Fatal Änderungen in Firmware V1.1 / Fatal changes in V1.10

  • ==================DE=============


    Fatal Änderungen in Firmware V1.1


    Automation der Routen war dramatisch verändert!


    In V1.1 Firmware:
    Wenn Bahn Kontakt Bestimmungsort (ZNR) berührt, werden alle Befehle in Karte "im Weg", die noch nicht ausgeführt - wird gelöscht


    Im Gegenteil:


    Aber in V1.070 Firmware:
    Alle Befehle in Karte "im Weg" wird unabhängig davon ausgeführt werden, die Aktivierung des Kontakts Reiseziel!



    Diese dramatischen Veränderungen schneidet die Fähigkeit zur Herstellung von präzisen Bremsen!
    nämlich:


    OBVIOUS Axiome:


    A) 1 Spur von Station muss eine lange Kontaktzeit und kurze Kontakte an den Enden.
    B) Lange Kontakt muss Länge der längste Zug.
    C) lang Kontakt muss der Kontakt der Aktivierung oder als Kontakt Bestimmungsort verwendet werden, da Zug minimale Wahrscheinlichkeit des Verlusts elektrischen Kontakt haben, wenn alle Räder daran.
    D) Kurze Kontakte sind für eine präzise Bremsleistung beim ersten Rad zu berühren sollen.


    Beim Zug der Beginn des Kontaktes Ziel (Kontakt der langen Strecke) zu berühren - sie muss erhalten TrainID F Mini-Befehl und wird sich verlangsamen, um es zu Ende bis zu stabilen kleine Geschwindigkeit.
    Deshalb Zug wird mit Garantie kurze Kontaktzeit erreicht am Ende der langen Kontaktzeit, der Instabilität der BEMF und Decoder Bremsweg Trotz.
    Dann, wenn Zug Short Track am Ende der langen Kontakt zu berühren, muss sie erhalten TrainIdFStop Befehl ein, und TrainID (F4 = EIN) Befehl. F4 = ON wird das Löschen von Weichheit Geschrieben in CV2 und CV3 produzieren. (Im Ziel, der Zug über scheidenden Weichen überrannt zu entfernen)


    Als Ergebnis - jeder Zug wird immer stabil erreichen die gleiche Stopp-Punkt.


    Firmware V1.1 delete TrainIdFStop und Rangier-Befehle nach der Aktivierung des Kontakts Ziel, und mein Zug fährt ohne Halt an der Station.


    Firmware V1.1 deaktiviert diese exzellente, zuverlässige und präzise Art und Weise der Bremsen, das war am Anfang erwähnt.


    Bitte schicken Sie diese Fähigkeit!


    ----------
    Vadim


    ===================EN================


    Fatal changes in FirmWare V1.1


    Automation of routes was dramatically changed!


    In V1.1 firmware :
    When train touches contact of destination (ZNR), all commands in KARTE "IN THE WAY" which are still not executed - is being deleted


    On the contrary:


    But in V1.070 firmware:
    All commands in KARTE "IN THE WAY" will be executed regardless activation of contact of destination!



    This dramatical changes cuts the ability for making precise braking!
    Namely:


    OBVIOUS AXIOMS:


    A) 1 track of station must have one long contact and short contacts at the ends.
    B) Long contact must have length of longest train.
    C) Long contact must be used as contact of activation or as contact of destination , because train have minimal probability of loosing electric contact when all wheels on it.
    D) Short contacts are intended for precise braking when first wheel is touching it.


    When train touch the beginning of contact of destination (contact of long track ) - it must receive TrainID F Mini command and will slow down to it's end up to stable small speed.
    Therefore train will reaches with guarantee short contact at the end of long contact, inspite of unstability of BEMF and decoder braking distance.
    Then, when train will touch short track at the end of long contact, it must receive TrainIdFStop command, and TrainID(F4=ON) command. F4=ON will produce deletion of softness writen in CV2 and CV3. (In aim to remove train overrun over outgoing turnouts)


    As a result - any train will stably always reach the same stop point .


    Firmware V1.1 delete TrainIdFStop and shunting commands after activation of contact of destination , and my train goes without stopping at station .


    Firmware V1.1 disables this excellent, dependable and precise way of braking which was mentioned at beginning .


    PLEASE, RETURN THIS ABILITY!


    ----------
    Vadim

  • This is 3 video demonstration which will help to understand principal of precise braking in V1.05
    Das ist drei Video-Demonstration, die dazu beitragen Prinzip der präzisen Bremsen in V1.05 verstehen wird



    1) The train movement through contacts:
    1) Die Zugfahrt durch Kontakte:


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NKDeoovufDM


    2) How it looks in Viessmann Diagramm:
    2) Wie sieht es im Viessmann-Diagramm:


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dAenCvnSxLc


    3) Route Content:
    3) Anfahrt Inhalt:


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-SNkr2KNLM


    --------
    Vadim

    • Offizieller Beitrag

    Thanks Vadim for your excellent explanation.


    This change was necessary, because it was a bug in the 1.070 version.


    If the "on the way contacts" are not deleted after the deactivation of a route, they remain active forever or until the Commander is switched off. This means, that if a train did not activate them (for example, it was stopped manually, or it went on a different track etc.), they become dangerous: for example 2 hours later a completely different train goes through that contact, and it triggers the functions of a long forgotten route. Suddenly a train somewhere else starts, or signals are switched, without knowing what caused it. This is why we made the following change in 1.1: after a route ends, all on-the-way contacts belongig to that route are deactivated.


    However, based on replies that the on-the-way contacts were used to stop the trains in some situations, we are redesigning the functionality of the "automatic reset" and the way how the routes are deactivated. An update will be released in the next few days.


    A solution for the functionality presented in your example, which should work even with the original 1.1 :
    - exchange the last on-the-way contact with the destination contact
    - set the speed to 0 on the last on-the-way contact and set F4 on the destination contact (Karte 7). You can set the speed to minimum on the second on-the-way contact. Another method: set speed to minimum on the last (an long) on-the-way contact, and you set the speed to 0 and set F4 on the (short) destination contact.

  • Zitat von Jürgen Meier


    Thanks Vadim for your excellent explanation.


    Thanks! We will very hot to waiting corrected firmware as soon as possible!


    Zitat von Jürgen Meier


    If the "on the way contacts" are not deleted after the deactivation of a route, they remain active forever or until the Commander is switched off. This means, that if a train did not activate them (for example, it was stopped manually, or it went on a different track etc.), they become dangerous: for example 2 hours later a completely different train goes through that contact, and it triggers the functions of a long forgotten route. Suddenly a train somewhere else starts, or signals are switched, without knowing what caused it. This is why we made the following change in 1.1: after a route ends, all on-the-way contacts belongig to that route are deactivated.


    I will explain why it's not worth to do this clearance in V1.1:
    1) Because, by manual movements, You cannot have automatical name translation from one ZNR field to other and from one occupancy contact to other, therefore any manual movement of loco will disorder any automatical movements at all! It's not applicable, until You would link each ocupancy section to each other in your firmare (Like in TrainController), and until You will embedd fully automated and safe(matrix) loco name following inside your Commander during it's manual movement! (also Like in TrainController)


    2) Moreover, this occasional stop will not lead to crash and can be removed by second try of manual movement. It's not so big sacrifice!


    3) This V1.1 changes makes much more crashes and discoveniences than conveniences!
    Simly Rule will solve this problem :
    WHEN YOU RUN AUTOMATION, PLEASE DONT MANUALLY TOUCH THESE LOCOS!
    This rule make big sence!



    Zitat von Jürgen Meier


    A solution for the functionality presented in your example, which should work even with the original 1.1 :
    - exchange the last on-the-way contact with the destination contact
    - set the speed to 0 on the last on-the-way contact and set F4 on the destination contact (Karte 7). You can set the speed to minimum on the second on-the-way contact.



    I already tried it!
    1) I ll explain in details: I have N-Scale layout. N-Scale has not so stable contact betwen loco wheels and rails. Therefore, this method will work too unstable with respect to activate next route, because first axle, by touching it, cannot have stable contact with short end contact in comparison with long contact where train have almost all wheels with current suply. This contact can became empty at any moment!


    2) Also, because of this reason, this method will lead to high probabilty of crashes because destination contact with loosing current supply will believed as empty for next train. For safety, in aim to remove it, in addition to other contacts, i must insert long contact in feedback page, - but where i already havent any space!!!!


    3) It would be convenient to make order of contacts and strategy like in TrainController (or RocRail...)
    It will allow to do very simply switching between Commander and Computer with TrainController, doing simply interconnection of S88!


    Zitat von Jürgen Meier


    Another method: set speed to minimum on the last (an long) on-the-way contact, and you set the speed to 0 and set F4 on the (short) destination contact.


    It wil lead to previous case, where ZNR contact must be as destination contact, but i already explained why it's too unstable!



    My wish to You:
    Please do this device and strategy professionally, Not like a Toy!

    ---------
    Vadim

    • Offizieller Beitrag

    For this purpose there is a much safer and better solution. In the feedback editor you can specify the short contact as a "moment"-contact by selecting the "MOM" button in the left panel. This means, when this feedback contact is touched by the train, it will turn permanently on, and it will remain red even if the contact between the train and this feedback is lost. In the following route you can then set this contact back to gray.

  • Zitat von Jürgen Meier

    For this purpose there is a much safer and better solution. In the feedback editor you can specify the short contact as a "moment"-contact by selecting the "MOM" button in the left panel. This means, when this feedback contact is touched by the train, it will turn permanently on, and it will remain red even if the contact between the train and this feedback is lost. In the following route you can then set this contact back to gray.


    I know it, but i believe that it's not good and robust solution to have 2 ZNR's in one station way!
    It will also require additional space in feedback KARTE. But i havent it! MoreOver, i have no space in swiching area of many routes for manual resetting contact operation. You give us so little space in all route pages (KARTEN). Please expand it at least, TWICE in next firmware as soon as possible!


    Moreover when i swich off automatic, how to move train manually in aim to start automatic again from other points, simply by one button, dont touch MEM contacts?
    The train which locked MEM contact will be abscent but route containing following reset will unconditionally start!





    I suggest that it will be too conwenient to do the following changes:


    1) Add BRIDGE symbol to diagramm. This symbol must have property to link opposite sides.


    2) Add property to LINK all adjacent contacts together automatically according DIAGRAMM (all track and ZNR symbols) to make a graph of ways inside Commanders programm using turnouts as nodes. Bridge symbol will help to do link in complicated layout and resolve ling through crosssection!.


    3) Divide Safe Matrix into 2 parts: Manual and automatic. Automatic part must be builded for all routes automatically using builded graph. This property will SIGNIFICANTLY simplify addittion of new routes to big quantity of existing routes without fiddly and time-eating procedure of re-editing safe matrix of all routes again when you add new one!


    4) Add to ZNR field PROPERTIES dialog. Where You will implement precise stopping method. This window must have main and, at least, 2 stop markers, and contain length of track entry in aim to implement extrapolate braking for different lengths in future. This also will help to correct closing route in right monent!


    5) CLOSE ROUTE MOMENT have the following condition: RESET ROUTE when (LAST [all] STOP contact[s] will be REACHED) or (IF NEXT ROUTE ACTIVATED AND REACHED TrainID start command) !
    This is PRECISE CONDITION, removing any forgetting of resetting or advanced errorneous resetting ! Please IMPLEMENT IT in Next FirmWare!


    IMPORTANT FOR UNDERSTANDING:
    Uppermentioned condition will do precise stop and smoth route by route following without ERRORS:
    a)If the train reached stop contact but next trace activated but still not start loco - it will stop loco at end precisely.
    b)If next trace activated and start loco when it still do NOT reached the stop contact - Stop commands at "on the way" KARTE will be deleted, and loco will smoothly continue!


    In aim to another sence of commands at "On the way" must be fullfilled - You can implement this stop method into ZNR properties.


    6) You must add to destination contacts KARTE new entrirs and add selection as "AND" or "OR" ,where destination contact will be first, and other will make a condition of closing of route.
    Also make an ability to make selection as CLOSING WHEN NEXT ROUTE WILL START LOCO.
    This KARTE must be renamed as "Name Transmition and Route Closing".



    ----------
    Vadim

  • Hi Vadim


    I have also had the problem of not enough space in the route index cards.


    I solved this by having more routes that start where the previous one finished at a track sensor.


    This was necessary in my case as there were to many turnouts in one route to be included in one route index card.


    John

    Commander with S88 Littfinski feedback for track monitoring and reed switches.


    5 amp booster connected to the CDE port.


    Lenz LI-USB interface connecting to a laptop via the LSB bus using RocRail software to drive trains manually via an Android phone.


  • John, Because Commander has restricted number of commands in FeedBack page, I must do enough time wait in aim to guarantee release of turnouts by last cars before starting crossing routes. Therefore i insert 60 second wait at switching area of each route. But when commander fulfill swiching commands - it cannot start any other route in parallel!!!! This is also DISADWANTAGE, which i still not mentioned above! Therefore, if i would divide route with large number of turnouts into 2 ones, i will get an intermediate non-realistic stop at turnout area, waiting to start second route.


    I mean, that Commander's teem must START reaching strong improvements fastly and qualitatively instead of our non-ordinary solutions, which looks like making patches at holed wear!


    -------
    Vadim